http://ayende.comAyende @ RahienCopyright (C) Ayende Rahien 2004 - 2021 (c) 202660Sebastien, It might, but that wouldn't probably do what you want. http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment19http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment19Mon, 26 Apr 2010 15:08:09 GMTCan the xml type of sql server, with help of xml indexes and Xquery be called a document oriented storage ? http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment18http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment18Mon, 26 Apr 2010 14:58:46 GMTWayne, At a rate of 30,000 new records an hour, after a year you'll have 262,800,000 records. I am not sure what you intend to do with them, but assuming that each row is 128 bytes in size (guid, couple of dates, an ip, maybe a url), you will have about 30 GB of data per year. I wouldn't worry about that. As for whatever a NoSQL solution would be good or not, that is impossible to say without more data :-) http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment17http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment17Tue, 20 Apr 2010 15:00:08 GMTI have just spent the day telling the CIO why a NoSql/Document database would be a bad place to store production reporting data 30000+ records per hour. He has read some blog posts saying that there is the solution to all storage needs and has reduced/no maintenance costs associated with NOSQL. So everything has to be converted http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment16http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment16Tue, 20 Apr 2010 14:33:25 GMTWayne, You might want to read the previous posts in the series, I am laying out a lot of information about how and why you want to use this. http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment15http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment15Tue, 20 Apr 2010 13:30:15 GMTFrank, Probably, I am not sure how you set things up in a object database to control the scope of storage to reduce the number of remote calls And as I am not an expert on OODB, I don't really know. http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment14http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment14Tue, 20 Apr 2010 08:45:56 GMTRafal, a) I was talking about DDD Aggregates, not Aggregation in general. b) Most Document Database has some support for aggregation. They call it map reduce, but it is the same thing. http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment13http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment13Tue, 20 Apr 2010 08:43:44 GMTSteve, Well, using jQuery's API, here is how you insert a document: $.ajax({ method: 'PUT', dataType: 'json', url: ' [http://localhost:8080/docs/users/](http://localhost:8080/docs/users/)', data: { name: 'ayende' } }); The Web UI for Raven is composed solely of calls like this one. And yes, there is even a wrapper around that to give you things like EditDocument, GetDocumentsPage, etc. http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment12http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment12Tue, 20 Apr 2010 08:42:54 GMTAs to working with aggregates, shouldn't an object database work equally well in this respect? http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment11http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment11Tue, 20 Apr 2010 07:38:06 GMTMongo does have support for basic aggregate functions... Complex aggregate operations can cause performance problem with huge data, they're normally solved using map/reduce across distributed processing power. http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment10http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment10Tue, 20 Apr 2010 06:24:42 GMTAggregates are quite natural for document databases? How? They are not supported by the db engine - if you want an aggregate you have to do everything yourself. In this way of thinking also statistics and reporting are 'natural' for document databases - provided that you bring in the missing data processing functionality. http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment9http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment9Tue, 20 Apr 2010 06:11:06 GMTAh btw... anonymous class in C# 3 and the new dynamic feature in C# 4 are the things that have made document-db to be a natural fit with .net applications... I mean, _amazingly_ natural! It is inevitable that document-db will now start gaining traction with the current state of .net language capability. http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment8http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment8Tue, 20 Apr 2010 05:32:02 GMTTiming can't be better! I've been exploring document-db lately, less about the technology itself, instead mostly on usage pattern, the best way to take its benefit, and how to apply things that we have taken for granted in rdbms-orm duet (e.g. transactions, n-level cache, lazy-load, join-load, stuff like that). Looking forward to your next posts http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment7http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment7Tue, 20 Apr 2010 05:16:48 GMTGood point Mohammad - since it's stored as JSON, it shouldn't much matter what the client is. Ayende, would your client api include calls from , ie. a javascript call ? I look forward to hearing more on the topic http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment6http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment6Tue, 20 Apr 2010 04:55:50 GMTMF, You'll have your answer in 3 days. In short, you never have conditional in deserialization code if you do it right. http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment5http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment5Tue, 20 Apr 2010 01:53:26 GMTSo how do you handle the case where you want to change the layout of a particular type of document? e.g. to support a new feature. Do you just have a process that upgrades all the documents in one go? Or do you end up with lots of conditionals in your deserialization code? http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment4http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment4Tue, 20 Apr 2010 01:24:34 GMT@Mohammad, so long as the framework you are using doesn't go too abstract. I find a lot of times trying to interact with a single system from different frameworks isn't always so easy. Example: using memcached from .Net, Java, and PHP. Depending on how the key hashes are generated can yeild very different results. http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment3http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment3Mon, 19 Apr 2010 23:06:22 GMTI think one of the other advantage of using NOSQL database is that the data can be consumed by any framework since it is kept in the form of document. This means you can put data using .NET Framework and get the same data out using Ruby or Python framework. http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment2http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment2Mon, 19 Apr 2010 22:30:09 GMTRalf, We actually have a pretty strong client side API. I would love to get your comments on it. http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment1http://ayende.com/4464/that-no-sql-thing-document-databases-usages#comment1Mon, 19 Apr 2010 21:53:40 GMT