http://ayende.comAyende @ RahienCopyright (C) Ayende Rahien 2004 - 2021 (c) 202660We should not forbid setting expectations on stubs. I know stubs are not mocks, but there are times that I want to just check if a method on a stub is called or not. So +1 for throwing if any expectations is not set. http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment12http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment12Mon, 30 Jun 2008 19:29:14 GMTI am in agreement with Jeremy. If the person crafting the test is a making a call to verify expectations but they have not set any then an exception should be thrown. Perhaps in this case it should throw new NoExpectationsSet(); (to steal a line from Scott's playbook). http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment11http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment11Sun, 29 Jun 2008 18:02:07 GMTIt's a shame the stub object has this method, ideally they wouldn't. If this can't be changed then Scott's suggestion of throwing an StubsAreNotMocksException(); seems the most logical so they don't end up writing bad tests. http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment10http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment10Sun, 29 Jun 2008 15:59:33 GMTSidar, VerifyAllExpectation is an extension method on object, therefor, stubs get it as well http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment9http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment9Sun, 29 Jun 2008 13:48:35 GMTWhy does generate stub return a type that has the ability related to verification at all ? Can't we discard the method at all from generated stub? http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment8http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment8Sun, 29 Jun 2008 10:24:38 GMTthrow new StubsAreNotMocksException(); http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment7http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment7Sun, 29 Jun 2008 07:29:19 GMTa) user may assume that this is a valid thing to do. b) this is a bad test design http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment6http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment6Sun, 29 Jun 2008 04:45:37 GMTWhy throw? If you say make it difficult to do the incorrect thing, wouldn't a no-op be better than a thrown exception. In other words if the "wrong" thing has no side-effect (being a no-op), why is it the wrong thing at all? http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment5http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment5Sun, 29 Jun 2008 04:33:08 GMTUpon further thought while reading the subsequent post on the behaviour of stubs versus mocks, I think I need to clarify my "+1 for throwing" to instead say: +1 for throwing from VerifyAllExpectations calls on stubs and mocks that do not have any expectations set on them. (That way my preference is consistent regardless of how the whole stubs versus mocks behaviour thing goes ;) http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment4http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment4Sun, 29 Jun 2008 03:12:42 GMT+1 for throwing http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment3http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment3Sun, 29 Jun 2008 03:07:18 GMTThrow. Make it difficult to do the incorrect thing.. http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment2http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment2Sun, 29 Jun 2008 02:49:52 GMTI say "Yes, throw" or at least make it the default option. I would say that the developer might be confused here about what a Stub does and so is trying to use it incorrectly. They will likely get a false positive in their test and continue on without any indication there's a problem. http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment1http://ayende.com/3383/rhino-mocks-3-5-design-decisions-to-be-strict-or-not#comment1Sun, 29 Jun 2008 02:47:46 GMT