http://ayende.comAyende @ RahienCopyright (C) Ayende Rahien 2004 - 2021 (c) 202660Cool article! I've found it very tough to find a company that values technology, learning and even developers like me. I've hopped around several jobs for 8 years now and still haven't found such a company. I only read about them... I doubt they exist. :p I've worked at many places where they suck the life out of you. Not interested in learning and they decrease morale. I used to have pet projects but find it difficult to get excited anymore after working for companies and people who have no passion. Thank you Ayende for reminding me why I started coding in the first place!http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment103http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment103Tue, 25 Oct 2011 10:21:11 GMTI like Ayende's thinking; I don't work on pet projects every week but I have at least a 2-3 OSS I keep on the backburner and 1-2 active projects (active meaning monthly/weekly activity). Sometimes I don't feel like coding after work where I've spent coding... other times, I code for a week straight at least 10 hours. Depends on my motivation level and if any new video games have been released :) Anyway, I think it's a pretty good process and is probably one I'd follow if I were hiring. Points about passion that isn't just tied to pet projects is a good thing to remember, too, as some people are passionate but may not channel that into side projects. Still, I feel like even tinkering with sandbox projects is typical for passionate people but I guess I can't speak for everyone. I know I have a bunch of 1-2 hour sandbox projects in my "Fun" folder at work just to try shiny things out!http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment102http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment102Mon, 03 Oct 2011 22:01:38 GMTI think what Ayende is doing is sensible. Why would I want to hire someone who could possible be a geek/passionate/dedicated fellow etc when I already have lot many fellows in the queue who can readily show me their outside-office cool pet projects ? As a filter criteria (hasPetProjects), it makes perfect sense. I might rethink on this filter criteria only if there aren't too many folks after the filter. End of the day, this is all business :) http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment101http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment101Wed, 28 Sep 2011 04:52:10 GMTLet me start by saying that I work for a shop that has similar principles as Ayende. We must see passion in our candidates for us to feel they are valuable. But to look for one manifestation of passion, is to blind yourself to each candidates unique background. There are many ways to show passion towards your profession. For example, I am 27 years old, and have been programming for 13 of them. To those who know me, my passion is obvious. And I have had zero pet projects since my career began. My work ethic forces me to read blogs mostly outside of hours, leaving little time to create pet projects. It's ironic that my work ethic would count against me in a hiring process. Despite Ayende's post, I have trouble believing that if Ayende and I were at opposite ends of a table talking about my passion, that he would fail to see it in me. If you are wondering whether I agree or disagree with his process, its a yes and no. He will get good results, as it's very over selective. He will just burn through more candidates, and spend money doing so. But maybe one day half his workforce will band together and just create their own startup, when one of the pet projects take off.http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment99http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment99Tue, 20 Sep 2011 14:09:16 GMTComments count on this post is awesome. So i did not read all of them, excuse me if my comment is a kind of "alrerady-said". Ayende, your company is not like all others, but most of all applicants are the same...your (rigth) expectections should be clear to find the right target, or you will have to sort out these tons of CVs. In (pure) theory, the ideal add (expressing requirement at the right levefl) will bring you only a single CV: the right one! But that's not real life. You have to balance putting expectation too high and getting no candidate, or too low and getting too much CVs. This is where getting a good HR could help sorting out CVs. Getting right people and processes can help you to solve this very difficult pb. Check where you have pain and then reduce it. It will never solve your pb, but make it easier to address. http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment98http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment98Mon, 19 Sep 2011 19:52:20 GMTI sympathise with you somewhat! Firstly, I can see what you're attempting to do with your "pet project" interview technique, and I also immediately expected the response you got in result. I have to agree that it still sounds like whenever you look for a developer you're just looking for another you! People are different, don't expect all person to spend 4 - 6 hours a week on a pet project (which ends up being pretty much another full day of working) like you do. Some of the developers I've found the hardest and most frustrating people to work with kept very up to date blogs, had more than 1 open source/pet projects, and were extremely passionate about coding. They were also the most argumentative and stubborn minded people I've worked with! On the other side, some of the best and most passionate developers I've worked with never wrote a line in a blog or ever worked on a personal project. My point really is some people live and breath code. Others need to take time away from it outside of work. Both can be equally as passionate as each other and can produce amazing products/projects results. I know you say you need some way to weed out the good from bad, but (in my opinion) what you're doing is a bit counterproductive. I could almost guarantee that the same % of excellent and passionate candidates exist in the list you rule out when compared to what you choose as your "best candidates because you have a pet project". On saying that, we all have our methods. You could argue against mine, and I could argue against yours. Neither is wrong, and we should just employ the techniques that work for us.http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment97http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment97Mon, 19 Sep 2011 09:15:35 GMTI've tried my best to understand what bothers me with this requirement. Well, fact of the matter is, that as a mother of two there's so much for me to fit in a day, with the juggle of work/home/motherhood commitments, that I hardly had 3 hours in the last week to watch a DVD that I've borrowed from the library, and hardly a moment to actually call the library and ask for renewal... (Think Linet from Desperate Housewives having time to do a "pet project" and you'll get the idea). What you're asking for is not my "spare time" (as I don't have any now) but something more substantial than that: initiative. You're asking for someone with the initiative to do something without specific user requirements - and frankly, even ten years ago, when the market was tough (like it is in the US today) , and I didn't have kids, I'd rather go to uni to freshen up my skills then do a pet project. That's me. So while asking for pet project on the ground of "I want someone with initiative" is a valid point, the other points are not. http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment96http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment96Mon, 19 Sep 2011 06:23:47 GMTCan't resist the temptation to comment on this. What author has blogged about is essentially the core value of being IT professional and well known for years. For those who are surprised to find working in IT means 60 to 80 hours a week, I wonder if you joined this profession after 2008. That 60 to 80 hours of course include hours in evening and weekend outside office. How one can possibly sustain such a life unless as the author indicated, one must enjoy doing it. Admittedly, this goes beyond hiring strategy or careen management. Passion is probably an understatement in all honest. Some replies described more precisely, it's an addict of finding better ways, technique to solve problems. if you don't find yourself interesting in searching problems so you can apply the newly acquired skills, technologies, then you don't belong to this league. Although more than often it is marketed otherwise so people outside IT feel you're rational, but truth is rational people who choose to work in IT for a careen or compensation reason will soon discover they probably made a mistake and there is more pain than gain. Aye de Rahien's hiring point of view is a repercussion of a recent trend. While the future of IT careen as well as the entire technology related job market looks better than ever, we're in a year after 2008 and demands are more focused on elite type of professional. Only the best of hardcores will remain in the field and bar is getting higher as technologies have evolved to be smarter. The days one can pick a programming book from bookstore then self-claim a seasoned candidate only to talk through the corporate ladder to become one of "overhead" are soon to be over. http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment94http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment94Sat, 17 Sep 2011 17:32:11 GMTFrans, If they are working on work related stuff, they get paid. Where they are doing that is not really relevant. And you need to make sharp distinction between _employees_ and _candidates_. I care a _lot_ about employees, about candidates, I most care that I won't waste too much time over people who turn out to be duds.http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment93http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment93Sat, 17 Sep 2011 09:24:48 GMT@Steve Py: "What assumptions are you drawing from this post? This isn't about working for free, or having Hibernating Rhinos, or any employer directly benefit from your unpaid work. This is about providing something that Oren has seen as a good indicator that you have passion for software development, nothing more. Even his original post was "... I don't think I want you", not "I don't want you." " I just asked a question whether compensation was granted for time spend on work-related matters in the employee's own time. I asked that because there's no word of it in the article, and because of that it illustrates the 1-way street thinking of employers (employees also often think it's a 1-way street: "I show up, so you pay me!" etc.) I'm not against asking for passion for the craft, that would be stupid. What I wondered, and MIchael was spot on, is that if you ask the employee to spend time on work-related matters in their own time, you have to compensate them for that. It's the same as when the employee demands something from the employer without 'compensation' (doing something in return), as it's a 2-way street. What annoyed me in the article was the air of the employer's narrow mindset: "you, the employee, have to be grateful to be allowed to even sit in that chair left alone getting payed for touching the keyboard" Over-exaggerated of course, but you get the point. I didn't address 'owning the projects/company and working on the projects is different from being an employee working on them' for nothing: it's logical that the employer (in the role of owner of the projects) searches for a person who is as passionate about the project as he is, but it's a quest which will not succeed: the employee looks at the project from a different angle, and not acknowledging that is IMHO a big mistake. So big that I wouldn't want to work for an employer like that, simply because you'll never be good enough. http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment92http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment92Sat, 17 Sep 2011 09:13:40 GMTAyende I 100% agree with you!!! I just can't understand, how many people see what you're asking for as a bad thing, come on!!! And I think that the "09:00 to 18:00 guy" is usually a bad choice. "If I don't learn it at job I don't learning at all" I cant see the passion in a guy like that.... By the way, what do you think about grades? They really matters or make a difference on a candidate? http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment91http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment91Sat, 17 Sep 2011 06:03:33 GMTI like stacey's comments. At least this is what I think passion should be in our field. I also agree that pet projects are good indicator for showing candiate's potential, but they aren't single source. But also I think that Ayende's "pet project criteria" isn't absolute truth, meaning that it's just one of his criterion (maybe with higher priority, depends). When there are many applicants, pet project requirement can filter out a lot of average programmers easily. But when there are some other candidates with different experience (exciting or otherwise not usual), I expect they dont get rejected automatically. But it also depends whom Ayende is looking for, exactly. I'll bet his not looking for some military experienced guy with no public portfolio, that's not his field, currently. When you whine that you can not qualify because some of the criterion (you have no pet projects or you don't have the time), then I'm sorry you don't qualify, it's his company and there are plenty of other companies out there. And if you can show your other characteristics why you are the best for he job (meaning you can distinguish yourself from other candidates without pet projects), then do your best and good luck (no sarcasm). I mean Ayende has it's own working culture and expectations, if candidate can't fill them, then it's bad luck, there's plenty of them who can. We all want to go to the moon but we can't...http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment90http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment90Sat, 17 Sep 2011 01:40:21 GMT@Alexei, Uh, who are you to tell him what he can, and cannot do? If Ayende hires duds with pet projects, or misses out on gems that have none, it's his company and mistake to make. If you work at Oracle and you build pet projects at work on their $ then it's their IP. But all you have to do is ask your manager for permission to use a bit of code from the little side project at home, and unless they're a complete prick you'll typically get it. If you build pet projects at home on your time, and bring them into work then you need to read the terms of your contract, but typically you talk to them first and if they're intrested you grant them a license to use your software thus maintaining your IP. Provided though that it's something that is not directly tied to their IP or domain knowledge specific to the project you are working on. (Just because the tool runs on an Oracle DB does not mean it would qualify against their IP provided you had a license to develop against that DB.) I've seen this nonsense about contracts where you sign away your IP when working at home on your own time, and unless it's a very specific type of role, it is either being misinterpreted by the employee (and possibly the employer) or it is most likely legally unenforceable. If you simply sign a contract without clarifying details like that, well then live and learn. When I see clauses like that which are too broad and read like it means anything I work on is their IP, I get it clarified in the contract. Applicable to their equipment or their $. If they insist, I walk away and wait a week to find a client that's more reasonable. Irrational demands like that are a good sign that you'd be looking at a crap job anyways. Usually the answer is that it was in the boiler plate their lawyer gave them, and they clear up that clause in the contract.http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment89http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment89Sat, 17 Sep 2011 00:58:57 GMTNo Ayende, what's irrelevant is when you started your projects. If you did this all while working at Oracle and you did them to be used by Oracle (even if only just internally) all of them would've been closed source and if you wanted to look for another job, you would have nothing to show for yourself as far as pet projects go. It's important to gauge applicant's coding ability, but you can't be correlating the lack of pet projects with lack of ability. You do not practice what you preach.http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment88http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment88Fri, 16 Sep 2011 20:20:51 GMTAs a talented, experienced and above all passionate professional Software Engineer who has done nothing other than Software Engineering since graduating with a degree in Software Engineering (getting the point :)) 16 years ago, I am very disappointed with the narrow minded dogma in this article. I have 0, yep 0 pet projects. That isn't because I am not interested, it is quite simply because I spend all my time working at the office, playing with my wife and children or reading about tech books. I also attend (and have spoken at) conferences. But yep, 0 pet projects. The flawed assumption is that there isn't a job which allows you to get the benefits you associate with pet projects. I would suggest you need to improve your professional offering so that pet projects aren't necessary. Requiring passion is *a good thing*, mandating how that passion should be demonstrated is short sighted. Not sure you have sold yourself in the best light here ;)http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment87http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment87Fri, 16 Sep 2011 20:10:32 GMTAgree with what you say as well. I do not want to work at a company where they will just hire anyone they can get. I took my current position because I knew it was important to them that I was passionate about software and continuous learning.http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment86http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment86Fri, 16 Sep 2011 19:50:52 GMT@"a developer dad's manifesto". Your link actually proves my point. I will cite directly from the article. "By doing this I’ve actually discovered that I can be more productive when I get away from the code for a while. I drive home, play with my daughter, eat dinner, bathe her, read her books, and put her to bed. All this time my brain is still spinning. My subconscious is still tossing problems around and searching for solutions." That is exactly right. The subconscious. He likes his job. He does not shut it out and ignore it. He is ready for the next day, and handles his priorities responsibly. I think a lot of the problem here stems from the fact that people are taking the term 'pet project' to mean 'actual pets'. It won't die if you don't feed it. It doesn't have to be good, complete, compiled, functional, even intelligent. It is your byproduct. It is the orange that a nurse plunges a needle into 50 times to practice an IV in medical school. It is the paper bullseye from the police firing range. It is the medical magazine that the doctor gets at home. It is the worn out, dust covered pencils in the artists bag that they only used 'that one time'. It is the personal accounting books of a CPA that they made compulsively out of habit. It is the notes scribbled in the side of a scientists notebook. The formulas that never got completed. The "I want to do this someday". The "yeah, my friends and I were talking about this in college". It is our trash. You guys are making pet projects all the time, you just don't see them that way because you don't care about them. And you shouldn't have to. You are programmers. That "ConsoleApplication1" through 23 in your Windows Recycle Bin that you never cleared out - each one maybe 15 lines long, where you saw an article and tried it. Maybe each one has a little NuGet packages config in it where you tried out a library for a few minutes. The painful ping in your right hand from right clicking two dozen times one day and clearing out the "Recent Projects" list in Visual Studio because it is cluttered with thirty samples that you downloaded just to see how Ninject worked with a particular framework. You don't need to spend 2-3 hours a day, a week, or even a month. You need to only spend 2-3 MINUTES at a time, and that is what you are constantly doing. That Silverlight(1),(2), and (3).zip file you have because you kept impulsively downloading it, forgot you downloaded it, clicked it again after you got interrupted... I think 'Pet Project' wasn't the exact term that Oren was going for. I think he is saying that he wants someone who will say "Ok, hang on a moment, let me see if I can find this typo" instead of"Sorry, it is 5:00 PM exactly, I am gone, even if you are the customer." Someone who will look down at their phone and casually tap on their RSS feeds, and will have at least 1 programmers blog that they check up on every few weeks. These are not bulleted list criteria. There is not a checklist of them that an employer can go down and eliminate someone by. But they tell the story of who the person is when no one is watching. And that is who he wants to hire.http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment85http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment85Fri, 16 Sep 2011 17:04:09 GMTAlexei, Really? I was doing NHibernate for years before I started giving courses on that. I was doing Rhino Mocks for years, and I didn't make a dime out of that. I have a LOT of projects that I started just for the sake of interest, from Rhino DSL to NMemcached. The fact that later on I found them useful is irrelevant.http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment84http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment84Fri, 16 Sep 2011 16:31:27 GMTAyende, I've just looked at your github profile and I see that all your projects are work related (raven/nhybernate/misc rhino stuff or courses you teach on those subjects). So you show passion for what you do and related fields, but not much else. Now you are lucky enough to work on an OSS friendly environment and thus can show that work. Those who work for closed-source houses do not have that luxury. So if someone was like you and they did have other projects and showed passion for their craft by doing related app development on their own time, they wouldn't be able to show it. So if you were working at such a place Ayende, and wanted to look for another job, you would fail miserably your own screening criteria. Seems hypocritical.http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment83http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment83Fri, 16 Sep 2011 15:36:40 GMTWOW, I am agree with every single word! This kind of thing I am constantly trying to explain to my colleagues. Doesn't actually work. Sad. God, I wish I had a chance to work in your company.http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment82http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment82Fri, 16 Sep 2011 14:59:32 GMTBut none of that matters anyways. You spend 80%+ of your life at your work. Leave work to money making endeavors, leave your home to your family. If you have side work, you will be harassed and contacted during your off hours, anyways. Throw a OSS project in there, and your family will forget your name! O.ohttp://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment81http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment81Fri, 16 Sep 2011 14:13:06 GMT@Harry Steinhilber And I work for a Fortune 75 on my daily job and a Fortune 40 on the side. The former STRICTLY requires all source to be signed over as its property, and the latter, requires strict NDAs and non-competes. Yes, some of these companies have Open Source olive branches, but that doesn't mean that you as an employee are privy to develop for them.http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment80http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment80Fri, 16 Sep 2011 14:05:12 GMT http://adamschepis.com/blog/2011/09/15/why-i-go-home-a-dads-manifesto/http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment79http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment79Fri, 16 Sep 2011 13:04:29 GMTStacey, That is wonderfully puthttp://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment78http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment78Fri, 16 Sep 2011 12:43:04 GMTI think something that is missing from this article is a real explanation of what a 'pet project' really is. I have dozens, if not thousands of 'projects' I have created over the years, and I am still considered a rookie. I have 17 years experience, a low paying job, and every single day I still run across a blog that makes me excited to open up my IDE and try out something new. Whether it is a new design philosophy, a new framework, a new library, not a single day that I am able to be at a PC goes by that I do not learn something. Most of my 'pet projects' end up becoming trash. I have 15 hand-coded OCR programs, 25 different ways to render an image to the screen using C#, I literally have a DVD of over 900 different versions of the same program as it progressed over the course of 3 months and I was too stingy to use a SVN system. A lot of people are taking this to say that we need to be feeding our income with supplemental software, but that is not the message I took away from it. What I got from it was "Do you love what you do? If you love it, it is not work. It is what you do because you want to do it. You just get paid for it when you are at work." 'pet projects' can be anything from throwing together a website for a friend to building a trivial little program for some beginner on stackoverflow to show them how to make a function of the language work like they are trying all the way to making a full github account just to contain some sacred repository of code that you want to share with the world. You don't want people that will look at the newest version of the framework and say "oh no, we have to upgrade everything." (though that will always be at the back of everyone's mind when the exhaustion sets in). You want people that will look at the new framework and say "oh wow, I love this new feature. And this one, I know where I want to use that. Damn it when is this coming live!? I want it now!"http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment77http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment77Fri, 16 Sep 2011 12:03:20 GMT@Michael & Frans : What assumptions are you drawing from this post? This isn't about working for free, or having Hibernating Rhinos, or any employer directly benefit from your unpaid work. This is about providing something that Oren has seen as a good indicator that you have passion for software development, nothing more. Even his original post was "... I don't think I want you", not "I don't want you." I'm sure if a junior developer submitted a resume that emphasised thier comitment and passion to the projects they worked on, along with other crafts or team-orientated they were involved in, and sounded genuinely interested in working with Hibernating Rhinos, they'd get an interview. The whole point I believe he's trying to make is how seeing code and how they approach problems. (Because they want to tackle the problem well, not because they just need to get something working to earn their paycheque.) IP issues generally mean people can't legally provide work-related code, but they can provide pet projects. Lately I've been providing candidates with a test project and a set of requirements to implement. (and hopefully unit test to prove their implementation meets those requirements) It really seperates out the nuggets from the slurry, and it takes about 2-3 hours to complete.http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment76http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment76Fri, 16 Sep 2011 11:35:19 GMTI have to disagree with this post. From the employers perspective, it is great. Something for nothing. From the employees perspective, it is horrible. Nothing for something. Frans has the right questions; do you pay people for their free time? Do you give them big bonuses? If not, it is just a scam like the growing trend of unpaid internships. The employer of course loves it, however as a professional, I value my time ands expect to get compensated for any activity that is a mandatory condition of employment. Recognizing your own worth is the first step along the path of not getting screwed by an employer.http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment75http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment75Fri, 16 Sep 2011 09:31:37 GMTAfter reading more comments, Its sad to see to many people with a mindset of 'I develop for work'. Software Development its a craft, and like any other craft it takes years of mastering, it requires passion, commitment, love and care. If you develop software for a living, then you are just someone to happens to work developing software but might not even like it. If you live to develop software then you might be a slave of our economy that cant do anything else or you might be obssesed because someone told you that software developers where making a lot of cash and suddenly software development became the thing to study just to do well in life. But if you love software development and happens to work at it, then you have the best work in the world because you are doing what you love and youre being paid for. So, @ayende dont put much thought on this. You love what you do, you receive money for doing it, and if I was you needing a helping hand, I would also have someone who loves software development as much as I do. Then, work would be filled with smiles because everybody shares the same mindset, and no one is there just for working and be paid, they would be there because they share the same love.http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment74http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment74Fri, 16 Sep 2011 08:50:17 GMTI totally agree with You with both of your posts. My wife sometimes complains that she don't understands how can I come home and sit behind a computer for an extra hour and I respond her always: I love technology, I love development and learning new things, I started at 8 and now at 33 Im more trainned that my coworkers and the most important thing is that its not my modus vivendi, its not my work or my career only, its not my hobby, ITS MY PASSION. I work for a financial software company, and our NDA's and contracts are very restrictive. How have I overcome that? Well, I just like to push things. For example, 2 of the newest products are simple PoC's that I assembled on my spare time and that I presented our CEO and the owners, and those 2 products have been doing really well on revenue because they started as PoC's so when they interested in them to evolve into products most of the work where done, just a little polish was required. They are satisfied with my job because they know that of all our staff Im the only one who is commited to learn a new technology in one night or that if someone else has a problem I will step in even when I dont master the topic. As we like to say here, Im wearing the companies shirt and Im in the best disposition to help our company grow and make our customers happy. And even that I can't post code from those PoC's or participate in OSS I have tried to remedy that sharing knowledge, for example, I can't post our code for OptimizedNETTCPBinding with Binary Compression and transport encryption but I have been able to give hints or test code and share tidbits about it, even a simple hint or general description can help others. Finally, how can I convince someone to hire me just by telling them what I have done without showing emotion, passion, commitment and interest. When I was interviewed for my first job I had no experience, but my soon-to-be boss decided to hire me just because I tell him that I loved technology and that I was even prepared to work for free for a month after that he could review my work and decide to pay me and keep me or to toss me not paying anything. After that month I didnt just keep my job, I was payed, salary raised and repositioned to a newly created New Technologies Area just because he saw I could save our company money by serving them in a technology recon position (i was in charge of looking out for new tech, learn it, analyze benefits and then prepare training for our staff for adoption).http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment73http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment73Fri, 16 Sep 2011 08:36:18 GMTIt's funny... in the amount of time some people have spent writing comments to this blog... they could have written a small "pet project"http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment72http://ayende.com/102403/pet-projects-and-hiring-decisions#comment72Fri, 16 Sep 2011 06:54:41 GMT